TARP: just another four letter word ~ unlikely burrito

tarp1

This is a tale of two cities and two banks. One bank, PNC (headquartered in Pittsburgh) very healthy (at the time), no need for federal TARP money and the other, National City (headquartered in Cleveland) sinking slowly into the abyss, desperately in need of TARP assistance. Both cities similarly situated economically.

National City Corporation was based in Cleveland, Ohio and founded in 1845, used to be one of the ten largest banks in America in terms of deposits, mortgages and home equity lines of credit. National City was expecting to be successful in their request for TARP money, however surprised in Washington; it was a Comptroller of the Currency, John Dugan, who informed National City executives they shouldn’t apply because their bank was too weak. Instead, he told the bank to sell itself.

PNC set their greedy eyes on National City. PNC was the first U.S. bank to use money obtained under the government’s $700 billion bailout program to make an acquisition. The acquisition, which completed on December 31, 2008, was described as a “take-under,” meaning the purchase price was below National City’s market value.

Results……

PNC Financial Services Group Inc. said Tuesday, just a little more than three months after receiving $5.6 billion, (yes billion with a “B”), that it plans to cut 5,800 jobs. PNC didn’t need to “take-under” any bank they just became greedy. Had the TARP funds had gone to National City as requested, I believe the National City would have recovered and jobs for both cities would have been preserved.

http://www.forbes.com/feeds/ap/2009/02/03/ap6003365.html http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_City_Corp. http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123258284337504295.html?mod=googlenews_wsj

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138 Comments

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138 responses to “TARP: just another four letter word ~ unlikely burrito

  1. dnd

    Interesting story Sra Burrito. Sounds similar to Wells Fargo taking over Wachovia.

    It’s no wonder Geithner wants to call the next go-round the “Financial Stability Plan” and not TARP II. TARP is tainted.

  2. Nannymm

    Thanks, UB. I wonder how many other tales like that we’ll hear as time goes on?

  3. dnd

    Watching Prez Obama in Ft. Meyers while trying to get some work done. Not getting much work done 😉

    It’s pretty clear in these sorts of forums, he’s in his element. It may be that using the bully pulpit helps him get bipartisan support rather than trying to deal directly with the extreme right that’s left in congress.

    It’s my sincere hope that in the midterm elections the extremist, both right and left, get voted out and are replaced by moderates who are willing to compromise.

  4. Hi everyone,
    The whole thing really stinks for Cleveland. The big layoffs are just starting and when a corporation the size of Nat City disappears, in a town as small as Cleveland, it disrupts the cash flow for the entire city and the burbs. No one remains unscathed.
    _______

    While watching President Obama last night, I was so proud to see an intelligent leader. I have faith and hope that we are heading in the right direction, and if the plan needs tweaking, I believe it will be tweaked.

    What a breath of fresh air, not listening to Bush…and his idiotic ramblings.

    back to work……enjoy your days

  5. Glad you posted this story UB, I’m afraid this is going to be just the tip of the iceberg. Thank god we have a new “sheriff” in charge!

  6. Nannymm

    You’re so right UB!

    Dnd, I’m watching Obama now, too. It is so wonderful to see the reception he is getting and the compassion he has for people. That woman is going to get help now for sure!

  7. Nannymm

    This doesn’t surprise me at all! It’s obvious that Obama is smarter than that moron who used to be prez.

    Obama’s Press Conference Answers Three Formal Grade-Levels Higher Than Bush’s First
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mark-nickolas/obamas-press-conf-answers_b_165467.html

  8. I loved the last questioner, he cracked me up, poor kid, 4 years working at McDonalds to get through school!

  9. dnd

    Dow down big. It was tanking before Geithner spoke, and now the financials are down. Guess they don’t like Geithner’s notion that recipients of the funds will have to be accountable.

  10. horsedooty

    wouldn’t you consider the market basically a Republican entity? They (the market) are not gonna like much of anything this Democratic administration has to offer I think.

  11. dnd

    I realize the President wants to look forward, but if I was him I’d do two things:

    1) Push for the reinstatement of the Glass-Steagall Act.
    2) Put Phil Gramm and Jim Leach on the steps of the capitol and tell the crowd that their bill to repeal the act is responsible for this mess and why you’ll be lucky to retire before 80, if at all. Bill Clinton should also be up there for not having the cojones to refuse to sign the bill into law. Then get the tar and feathers ready…

  12. dnd

    Doots,
    The market did pretty well during the Clinton administration.

  13. Nannymm

    LOL..I was about to say the same thing, dnd. My portfolio was roaring along back in the 90’s thanks to the Clinton economy.

  14. Oh no, not Western Europe, the repugs are making fools of themselves.

  15. WASHINGTON – The Obama administration on Tuesday overturned another Bush-era energy policy, announcing it was setting aside a draft plan to allow drilling off the Atlantic and Pacific coasts.

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/29119940/

  16. I was curious to see which three repugs supported the bill

    Maine: Collins and Snow
    Pennsylvania: Specter

    Independents: Lieberman & Sanders (VT)

  17. dnd

    Sra Burrito,
    Is Ken Salazar the best Sec. of the Interior or what?

    Hopefully this will be Colorado’s absolution for the gawd awful former Sec of the Interior, Gale Norton. Like Salazar, she was a former AG in Colorado. Norton made a point on devastating our public lands, and then went on to get a job with Shell. Looks like we can expect better from Salazar…

  18. So this asshole sheriff has arrested people who were at the party with Michael Phelps, WHAT A DOUCHE BAG!

  19. Nannymm

    What proof does he have? That photo is nothing!

  20. I think we have all the proof we need the sheriff is a MAJOR DOUCHE BAG!

  21. dnd

    I’m looking at the local Safeway weekly ad. There’s a small non- ad clip that says:

    Black History Month

    Shirley A. Chisholm 1924-2005

    We honor Shirley A. Chisholm, whose campaign motto “unbought and unbossed” helped her become the first African-American Congresswoman.

  22. dnd

    Dolly Parton speaking at the National Press Club:

    “Somebody said to me, ‘Well, you know what — you’ve got such a big mouth and you know how to talk to people, did you ever think about running for president?’” the country singer told an audience at the National Press Club. I said, ‘I think we’ve had enough boobs in the White House, but hopefully [President] Obama ain’t gonna be one of them.'”

    http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/category/dolly-parton/

    If you don’t love Dolly Parton, well, you don’t love America 😉

  23. GOP Group Threatens to Campaign Against Republican Stimulus Backers
    The National Republican Trust PAC is threatening to provide financial support for primary challengers to any stimulus-supporting Republican in the next election.

    http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/02/10/gop-group-threatens-campaign-republican-stimulus-backers/

    Well we all knew it was just a matter of time before they started eating their own, quicker than I thought though.

  24. dog's eye view

    for the chefs and bakers among us: Fresno Bee story, via McClatchy, on retired White House chef Roland Mesnier, visiting Fresno on February 18 on his book tour.

    Dishing on the White House, the people in it, and his “pastry disasters”:

    Former White House chef dishes out tales in Fresno
    http://www.fresnobee.com/lifestyle/v-print/story/1189945.html

  25. dog's eye view

    Thieving Siberian Husky returns to the scene of the crime.

    This dog covered some territory to filch that bone!

    http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/unleashed/2009/02/shoplifting-dog.html

  26. Nannymm

    That Siberian story is cute. it doesn’t surprise me, though. Siberians love to run and they travel far. My Siberian is a little thief, too. She gets in my kitchen cupboards and helps herself to treats.

  27. Salazar rejects Bush drilling plan

    Salazar rejects Bush offshore drilling plan for Pacific and Atlantic waters

    http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/news/2009/02/salazar_rejects_bush_drilling_plan.php

  28. Is it a sign of intelligence when the President reads from a teleprompter at a news conference? I dont recall past Presidents doing that.

    Is it a sign of intelligence when the President filibusters every question he is asked?

    Is it a sign of intelligence to put off once again any new domestic development of oil. When the slowdown ends and recovery begins, oil prices will go right back to where they were.. this is of course assuming that currency exchange rates don’t destabilized

    And is it a sign of Intelligence to put up for auction another trillion dollars to foreign creditors

  29. dog's eye view

    Morning Vince, welcome. Good morning all.

    I saw plenty signs of intelligence at the press conference and in this administration’s first actions. Policies will be expanded and retooled as it becomes more evident what works, what does not.

    The previous administration left woes and depletion on virtually all fronts; one hopes the American people will be patient as the new administration sorts through the wreckage and discovers what precisely will address the problems inherited and issues undealt with for years, to our disadvantage.

    Plz note that the American people and the “press and pundits” are two different, discrete sets, with different expectations and timelines.

    On the oil front: this administration is committed to encouraging and supporting green technology and alternative energy R&D.

    Could very well be that domestic development of oil is broached again once technology for extracting it becomes environmentally safer and more cost effective, taking all long-term costs into account, and not merely price at the pump.

  30. horsedooty

    morning Brian. Off to the VA again to visit the leeches this AM. My Dr is very big on blood work. So, I will go subject myself to the needle wielding vampires in the lab at the VA. See y’all later.

  31. dnd

    Chuck Hagel will take over Jim Jones slot as chair of the Atlantic Conference.

    My prediction: when Gates gets the troops out of Iraq he’ll want to step down and Hagel will take over at Defense.

  32. dog's eye view

    morning again, all. Obama is coming to Springfield, VA today to look at roadbuilding in progress and discuss infrastructure improvements. Gov. Tim Kaine will be here too.

    Yup. Sounds about right. Literally nothing else special about Springfield but its location at the confluence of many major roads (I-95 and the mythical beltway) and our one, count it, one stylish and upscale restaurant. We are desperately underserved relative to the housing stock.

    So, am considering it lucky that our President is visiting one place in Virginia where there is no “there” there. Except road-building! They have made it relatively easy to scram.

    Weirdly enough, there’s a drug treatment program SOMEWHERE in Springfield that the late Princess Diana visited during her first or second visit to DC area, way before the marriage was thought to be in trouble.

    And McCain-Palin appeared at a rally at a moving company last year.

    Maybe event planners are subliminally thinking “Simpsons” and everyman in choosing our garden spot?

    Peoria and Fort Wayne and all the other towns dissed for being being backwaters?

    I suspect THEY have local character and — at least — old buildings.

    We tore our 1950s Marriott Hot Shoppes down years ago.

    Welcome President Obama and Governor Kaine!

  33. dog's eye view

    Here’s wiki on Springfield. All it talks about is our roads and our mall, which has hosted 2 stabbings and a fatal shooting in recent years (they are not up to date on our recent victim carjacked at gunpoint from the mall and killed in the resulting crash).

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Springfield,_Virginia

    I live in West Springfield. That’s big here, reminding others you live in “West” Springfield. A little farther from the mall, and you wouldn’t shop there (but for Target) anyway.

    Springfield, Virginia.

    Wasilla near the Potomac.

    No mayor. No moose.

  34. I don’t know about any of you, but I for one am so sick of these Bankers. I am starting a list of which banks/brokers I refuse to do business with:
    Citibank
    Bank of America
    Merrill
    PNC
    Key Bank
    eTrade

    like Barney Frank said this am “if they don’t want to follow the rules attached to the funds, then give the money back!”
    ________
    Investigation of big bonuses, during Tarp times

    http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/12/business/12merrill.html?ref=business

    Mr. Cuomo said the four people who were most highly paid at Merrill were paid an aggregate of $121 million, and the next 10 received $128 million.

  35. dog's eye view

    Burrito: maybe we will see people choosing to bank with local banks, many of which stuck to their knitting and didn’t embrace the titanic risks and lifestyle?

    Although it’s might convenient to have a BoA account when you are traveling the US.

    I hope the feds can claw back most of the money misspent on executive compensation and bonuses, over many years. It was robbing their companies and shareholders, legally.

  36. dnd

    “Wasilla near the Potomac.” LOL! That’s great dog.

  37. dnd

    Sra Burrito,
    Two words: Credit Unions.

  38. dnd,
    That funny you say that, there is one in our building and up until now, I have never taken the time to learn anything about them.

    I always thought they were for groups of people, like you had to belong….I really know nothing about them.

  39. dnd

    Sra Burrito,
    They are owned and operated by members. Typically have a fewer assets than banks, so they are VERY careful with whom they loan money. Lower overhead than banks too.

    Check the regs in your state on credit unions, as they vary.

  40. repug said to the 8 bankers,” let you get back to what you do well,”

    what’s that? screw-up the entire economy? issue big bonuses to themselves with our money? screw credit ratings and go bankrupt?

    I need a chill pill….

  41. thanks dnd.

    ::::::::chillin:::::::::

  42. Go Ms. Waters! she’s speaking my mind….

  43. If there’s any single group of people who are more irresponsible and reckless thank bankers it is Congress. I think there is something a little bit more than self-serving for this Congress to presume to be the banker’s betters.

    I hope the Bankers dont take it like doormats the abuse they’re going to endure. It’s in Congress interest to gin up as much public anger against these banks as possible. That is to cover up the Congress’ own responsibility for their mismanagement of national budget, the banking laws, the GSEs, the Federal Reserve. Congress created all these Frankenstein Public-Private Entities that have run amok and destroyed our wealth.

    I want to see Congress on the other side of the Committee Room .. starting with Barney Frank and Shumer.

    Congress wants us to focus on the Bankers and I am not in the least bit inclined to do anything this Congress wants.

    That’s my opinion.

  44. Hi Vince – Thank you for posting.

    I am not even remotely interesting in comparing bankers to congress……it’s apples and oranges. To fall into that type of discussion is a diversion from of addressing real financial issues.

  45. dog's eye view

    Vince: welcome. How did you find us on backchannel?

  46. I know a lot of bankers…….they played free and easy for so long, and now…..if they take the taxpayers money then they should just consider they have a “New Investor” to answer to.

    They don’t like it when the tables are turned.

    Play by the new investors rules or don’t take the investment!

    Of all people, bakers should understand those rules of the game.

  47. Dog- there are a few good small banks here….I am looking to them as well.

  48. Hello.. I was doing a websearch for.. i’m trying to remember.. an obscure quote by someone I’m at work right now and dont have the history to remember but this was one of the few places that had it.

    I understand people’s anger and disgust at the banks.

    I just see all of this problem as stemming from one govt decision after another .. all of which had side effects that no one anticpated. At a basic level. these insitutions did exactly what Congress wanted them to do. Congress depended on this activity to fund the mortgages in the country.

    Most of you and I weigh these repsonsibilities differently, I put the bulk of the onus on the Government both branches, both parties.

    I often say. do you blame your lungs for breathing? Why blame Wall St for being ‘greedy’.. that’s what they do.. Govt should know that. Govt depended on that greed to fulfill their housing agenda.

    Have you guys watched the Fannie Mae Congressional Hearings in December? I did.. it’s what fuels my anger at Congress. What Wall St did is nothing compared to what Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac did. I really recommend wathcing it.

    It comes in two segments, the first with the most recent CEOs of FM and Fm (Raines Johnson Mudd).. you will cry at how inept these idiots were.

    The 2nd hearing is worse. it’s of analysts who are testifying on the aftermath of what FM has done.

  49. unlikely: I dont know any bankers.. maybe if i did my anger would balance out 🙂

  50. Two more banks to add to my “stay away” list:

    Citizens Bank
    Fifth Third Bank
    _______

    There is no doubt that there is incompetence in all segments of our economy and government.

    The hearing today is to offer the bankers the opportunity to speak for themselves, and answer the questions and the anger of their “new shareholders.” I think it’s a good thing, even if it a bit late.

    I am glad they are streaming it, and televising it.

  51. What this Melon bank is saying is true about being “encouraged” to participate in the Govt money scheme.

    Paulson FORCED ALL the major banks to take bailout money.

    Yet another reason i’m not all that incensed at the banks in general… a lot of them were in good health and yet forced to take money anyway.

  52. Vince , you know, I bet it would….in a big way…lol 🙂

  53. I just prefer to hear the bankers “explain” instead of “blame”….I guess that will come in the Q & A session.

    At least, the bankers were wise enough not to fly their private jets to the hearing….they’ve got that gong for them. 🙂

  54. But that means the private airport workers have less work to do

  55. dnd

    Vince,
    You are exactly right. When congress repealed the Glass-Steagall Act, the bankers pounced. Expecting them to do otherwise would be foolish. The unintended consequence was running their business into the ground.

  56. Did you know that Glass-Steagall was basically forced on the Govt to pass because somehow it was allowed that Citibank and Travellers merge.. and that that merging created a company that violated the bank laws.

    And also , written into the repeal was the requirement that all banks that were to enter the new markets had to have a CRA Audit and pass it. If a bank didnt have the requried CRA loans, they would be barred from expanding, merging, etc..

  57. dnd

    Vince,
    “Did you know that Glass-Steagall was basically forced on the Govt to pass because somehow it was allowed that Citibank and Travellers merge.”

    I’m guessing you meant the “repeal of Glass-Steagall” since there was no Citi in 1933. We have Phil Grahamm and Jim Leach to thank for this, along with Bill Clinton for signing it into law.

  58. Just to let you know folks, I’m up against a deadline and won’t be changing the thread today.

  59. dnd

    Happy birthday Caribou Barbie! Also too, doncha know, by golly.

  60. We need to have a party in her honor dnd!

  61. dog's eye view

    I’m glad we’re not changing the thread. This one is timely and interesting!

    =====

    Has Jim Leach had much to say about the wisdom of his role in repealing Glass Steagall? Haven’t followed, but would guess he too is sadder and wiser.

    Have to always account for greed and short-sightedness; to work around those all too human shortcomings.

  62. dnd

    Brian,
    I’m bringing the moose chili 😉

  63. dog's eye view

    Gates Orders Review of Policy on Soldiers’ Coffins

    http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/11/us/11bodies.html?hp

    “[Gates] said he was ordering a review of the military policy that bars photographers from taking pictures of the return of the coffins, most of which are coming from Iraq and Afghanistan and go through Dover Air Force Base in Delaware. He also set a “short deadline” for a decision. The military has said the policy is meant to protect the privacy of the families of the dead soldiers and maintain dignity. But skeptics, who include some families as well as opponents of the war in Iraq, say that the bodies in the returning coffins are not publicly identified, so privacy is not an issue, and that barring photographers is a political maneuver meant to sanitize the war.”

    More evidence that adults are back in the house.

  64. Obama Allies Launch New Ad Directly Attacking GOP Leaders — White House Told In Advance

    President Obama’s allies on the left, AFSCME and the labor-backed Americans United for Change, are ramping up with a massive advertising blitz containing the most direct and hard-hitting attack yet on specific GOP leaders, demanding that they get behind the recovery package and stop saying “No.”

    http://theplumline.whorunsgov.com/stimulus-package/obama-allies-launch-new-ad-directly-attacking-gop-leaders-white-house-told-in-advance/

  65. Sen. Tom Harkin, D-Iowa, said that negotiators restored $6 billion in lost funding for school repair and modernization projects during talks Tuesday, and had also increased aid to state governments to $44 billion instead of the $39 billion approved in a compromise with a handful of Senate GOP moderates.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/02/11/stimulus-deal-obama-team_n_165912.html

  66. dnd

    “Henrietta Hughes Given Home After Telling Obama She Was Homeless”

    One down, millions to go…

  67. dnd

    School repair? Not sure I buy it. From 4th grade through high school, my school buildings were supplimented by what were euphemistically called “temporaries;” which were surplus Army barracks. They were cold in the winter, hot the rest of the year, uncomfortable and very ugly. But they got the job done. The kids didn’t care, but I’m sure the teachers who were exiled to the “temporaries” hated them.

    Upgrades on the other hand could be huge, particularly in poorer school districts. Making sure they have adequate computers for students and internet access along with books online could be a great leveler between disparate school districts. The competition between hardware and software companies to get their products into classrooms would be fierce, ensuring minimal taxpayer costs. And well educated kids are the boomers insurance policy that they won’t be eating cat food and saying “Welcome to Wall Mart” in their senior years.

  68. I fear nothing good is coming from this bill. It’s 100% debt. It’s not what it says it is. The whole world knows that Pelosi has politicized this bill. Before this bill was announced I have plenty of articles stating how difficult of a time the Treasury Dept was going to have financing the estimated deficit and now it’s being doubled.

    I dont think we’re going to be able to get away with borrowing another 1T … Something is going to give and I agree with some of the economists who have predicted this entire crisis.. that the dollar is going to collapse.

  69. The dollar not going to collapse! That’s an absurd notion.

  70. dnd

    If the dollar collapses, so does every other currency on the planet. That would probably be bad…

    Vince, Yes Pelosi has politicized this bill. So has McConnell. All those tax cuts in the Senate bill may be a good thing, but they are not stimulative.

  71. “the sky is falling”

    _______

    I do wonder if these banks have considered what they are going to do when there revenue stream from their various credit card substantially decline…..I believe for many people, the days of living on credit are over, and most people will not tolerate Credit Card rates of up to 29.99%.

    That was, and still is a huge money maker for the banks, better known as how to legally rape the American consumer. ( the default on Credit cards are going to sky rocket…that is all unsecured debt.)

    Reasonable rates are fine…..but once again reasonable wasn’t on the minds of these companies.

  72. dnd

    For those of you who missed it, PoP has a new member of the family and the pitter patter of little feet around the house:

    http://morning-martini.blogspot.com/

  73. awe….now that’s one cute little baby!

    Thanks for sharing that dnd.

  74. dog's eye view

    re cracking down on onerous (egregious, really) credit card company practices: note that the new legislation will not take effect until fall of 2010, if memory serves.

    Why did they get such a long window? The relief was due ASAP. 2010 is way too far in the future.

  75. Nannymm

    But the devil is in the details, Brian.

  76. more money for schools and infrastructure, that’s a good thing!

  77. Nannymm

    I’ll agree that it’s better than it was. But still way too much in tax cuts!

  78. Honey you’re preaching to the choir!

  79. Nannymm

    True but I feel better bitching about it anyway. 😉

  80. We’d expect nothing less!

    🙂

  81. dnd

    “more money for schools and infrastructure, that’s a good thing!”

    Construction workers, architects, project managers, office managers, equipment and materials suppliers, network engineers, system administrators, hardware and software manufactures. Yeah I’d say that’s a pretty good deal.

    Oh, and a better educated (eventually) workforce.

  82. dnd

    Borrowing money from China so that we could afford Bush’s tax cuts are part of what got us into this mess. So don’t get me started.

    We are over taxed, but it’s because we spend on worthless projects in times of prosperity. Spending in times of economic disaster is the only recourse. Once we get out of this, we’re gonna have to hit the reset button and switch to a new economy.

  83. dnd

    Smart to make Robert Gibbs the Press Secretary. He’s as likable and self-effacing as Tony Snow, so it’s hard to beat up on him.

  84. BevnTempe

    Octo-mom launches website for donations. Gosh, who could have predicted that?

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/02/11/octuplet-mom-nadya-sulema_n_166030.html

  85. dnd

    “NEW YORK — Snap, crackle … pot?

    Bursting with indignation, legions of legalize-marijuana advocates are urging a boycott of Kellogg Co., including all of its popular munchies, for deciding to cut ties with Olympic hero Michael Phelps after he was photographed with a pot pipe.”

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/02/11/kellogg-boycott-pot-activ_n_166120.html

    I don’t get this. If anything they should boost their endorsement of Phelps. Do they have any idea of the number of college kids with the munchies who eat their cereals straight out of the box?

  86. I guess there’s always the pot friendly cereal as a back up….

  87. http://uk.reuters.com/article/usTopNews/idUKTRE51A4QI20090211

    “Ruth Madoff pulled $10 million on December 10, the day before her husband was arrested and charged with running a global investment fraud, and $5.5 million on November 25, according to Massachusetts Secretary of State William Galvin.”

  88. Nannymm

    Re: OctoMom’s website. Did you all notice that you can leave a comment but can’t read comments? I’ll be she’s getting some really negative feedback from the general public.

  89. I’m cheap, I buy generic frosted mini-wheats in a bag!

  90. dnd

    I didn’t go to OctoMom’s website, nor do I plan too. But one of the interesting observations is that whenever there are these kind of multiple births, baby stuff manufactures are usually tripping all over themselves getting their stuff to the family. Good PR. Likewise community outreach programs.

    Not in this case. I think the (possibly correct) perception is that this woman is seriously disturbed.

  91. dnd

    “I’m cheap, I buy generic frosted mini-wheats in a bag!”

    As long as you feed the dogs well, we don’t care what you eat 😉

  92. dnd

    “nor do I plan too” should be “nor do I plan to” though ending a sentence on a preposition ain’t my grammatical style either.

  93. dnd,
    It Cleveland everyone says, ” where you at? ” I’m not a stickler for many things but that one gets to me every time I hear it.

  94. well lets see for breakfast my dogs had lima beans and sardines in tomato sauce, and just now they had boiled chicken and rice, string beans, raw carrots and sweet potato. You be the judge as to eats better around here!

  95. dnd

    Sra Burrito,
    In Minnesota they say “you wanna come with?”

    Actually I’m not a big grammar cop, since really I don’t understand the law, in casual conversation. But in the written word I generally expect more unless it’s part of the narrative.

  96. dnd

    Lima beans and sardines for breakfast? I’m hoping you took the pooches for a walk to “air” things out.

    It’s clear that you pups are eating well!

  97. dnd

    “A Boulder High student group is pushing to rename the school after a hot new historic figure: Barack Obama.

    “We initiate this campaign in order to honor the momentous achievement of his election as an African-American, inspire the community with his ideals of unity and hope, and reflect the progressive spirit that is shared by both Barack Obama and our school environment,” the Student Worker Club said in a press release today.”

    http://www.rockymountainnews.com/news/2009/feb/11/students-rename-boulder-high-barack-obama-high/

    Interesting as Boulder has almost no Blacks. Most of the minorities are Hispanics.

  98. My dogs eat beans all the time, never had a gas problem!

  99. dnd

    “My dogs eat beans all the time, never had a gas problem!”

    Et tu Brian?

  100. dnd

    When I said Boulder had almost no Blacks I didn’t mean to imply there were none. One of my favorites is Dr. Warren Washington, a climatologist at the National Center for Atmospheric Research:

    http://www.cgd.ucar.edu/ccr/warren/

    If you read his bio, you’ll know that he’s not just any climatologist.

    I’ve only met Dr. Washington a few times via mutual friends. He is quite possibly the nicest person I’ve ever met. He has a remarkable ability to translate his extraordinary knowledge to those of us who don’t share his scientific sophistication. If you ever get a chance to attend one of his public speaking engagements, please go. I guarantee you’ll enjoy it.

    My suggestion to those kids at Boulder High is to name their school after Dr. Washington.

    And my suggestion to President Obama is to put him in charge of climate change.

  101. yeah beans don’t matter much to me, I’m naturally full of noxious hot gasses!

  102. dnd

    This is all your fault Brian.

  103. dnd

    Brian,
    Could this be the reason your dogs refer to you as an “old fart?”

  104. dnd

    Ok, I apologize for that 😉

  105. yeah, bad jokes should always be followed up with a swift apology!

    🙂

  106. dnd

    I rarely agree with Maxine Waters, but good God Almighty, I love that gal and her passion for the public.

  107. She was spot on tonight, i loved her going after credit card rates!

  108. Ok, Colbert was amazing and brilliant tonight!

  109. Hi.. I got busy at work towards the afternoon and just back on computer now.

    I just wanted to say thanks to you guys , even though we disagreed we weren’t disagreeable.

    Seems rare nowadays.

  110. rare in deed, don’t be a stranger!

  111. dog's eye view

    Happy 200th birthday, President Abraham Lincoln.

    He really deserves his own day, not just “Presidents’ Day” shopping holiday.

    The 4th of July has not become “Patriots’ Day” or “American Documents Day”, even though we focus on fireworks and BBQs and summer.

    Lincoln kept the country together and lost his life for doing it.

    If you have major political parties vying for ties to you 144 years after your passing, wishing to claim your mantle … Lincoln has remained more relevant than 20th century presidents.

  112. horsedooty

    I think the problem is when I was a kid, Lincoln and Washington had birthdays in the same month. Lincoln on the 12th and Washington on the 22nd. We were out of school and no mail both days. The powers that be wanted only 1 day if any so someone drummed up Presidents Day.

  113. dog's eye view

    Hey, I am just glad no one made Ronald Reagan’s birthday a national holiday. Enough already!

    Lincoln was still a “controversial” president, right through recent years, in some parts of the country. In Richmond, you would still see the occasional crank letter to the editor re A Lincoln, war criminal… there were some maroons who protested his getting a statue downtown (he and his son) a few years back!

  114. Nannymm

    Good morning!
    And I agree, dog. Thank God we don’t have Reagan Day! Renaming the airport after him was MORE than enough, IMO.

  115. dnd

    Charles Darwin is also 200 today.

  116. dog's eye view

    still refer to it as “Washington National” in our house. There was no outcry from anyone but House Republicans to rename the airport.

    And then they forced Metrorail to fork out $$ a few years later for redoing all the signs to incorporate “Ronald Reagan” since the locals were quite fine with the original signage…

    ======

    Listening to our local public radio classical station; last day of their pledge drive (thank the lord), and thinking “why can’t those Wall Street banker tycoons be at least as inconvenienced as public radio staff, and have to make a case for and drum up public contributions to their banks?

    Why is it so easy for them to be handed parcels of cash, which is fungible, and which they turn easily into misbegotten bonuses, ahem, awards, for their stunning 2008 performance?

    Why aren’t they shilling for support and singing for their supper?”

    I wish Congress and our attorney general could pull back all the excessive executive compensation and bonuses dished out over years of horrible decisionmaking and greed. There is no reason Countrywide founder’s family and eventual heirs should have a field day with ill gotten gains.

    signed,

    dog the populist

  117. Vince P

    One similiarity btween Pres’ts Lincoln and Obama is that has provoked the States into examining and asserting their Soverignity and to warn the Federal Government that it is coming close to abusing its power

  118. Nannymm

    I’m not sure I understand your point, Vince. Can you explain a bit more?

  119. dnd

    Rep. Steve Austria:
    “When (President Franklin) Roosevelt did this, he put our country into a Great Depression,”

    http://thinkprogress.org/2009/02/11/austria-fdr/

    Woops! LOL!

  120. Morning peeps, new thread at noon.

  121. A number of States have before them similar bills that proclaim that the 10th Amendment establishes that the States are sovereign in all areas of authority the Constitution doesn’t forbid them.

    These measures are decrying every-increasing violation of their sovereignty by the Federal Government

    The States are
    Washington
    Arizona
    Missori
    New Hampshire
    Arkansas

    Colorado,Idaho,Indiana,Alabama, Texas might be next

    NH says any of the following acts will result in the disbandment of the US Constitution and reclamation of all sovereign power to the States.

    I. Establishing martial law or a state of emergency within one of the States comprising the United States of America without the consent of the legislature of that State.

    II. Requiring involuntary servitude, or governmental service other than a draft during a declared war, or pursuant to, or as an alternative to, incarceration after due process of law.

    III. Requiring involuntary servitude or governmental service of persons under the age of 18 other than pursuant to, or as an alternative to, incarceration after due process of law.

    IV. Surrendering any power delegated or not delegated to any corporation or foreign government.

    V. Any act regarding religion; further limitations on freedom of political speech; or further limitations on freedom of the press.

    VI. Further infringements on the right to keep and bear arms including prohibitions of type or quantity of arms or ammunition

    ———————

    Arizona says:

    1. That the State of Arizona hereby claims sovereignty under the Tenth Amendment to the Constitution of the United States over all powers not otherwise enumerated and granted to the federal government by the Constitution of the United States.

    2. That this Resolution serves as notice and demand to the federal government, as our agent, to cease and desist, effective immediately, mandates that are beyond the scope of these constitutionally delegated powers.

    3. That all compulsory federal legislation that directs states to comply under threat of civil or criminal penalties or sanctions or requires states to pass legislation or lose federal funding be prohibited or repealed.

    4. That the Secretary of State of the State of Arizona transmit copies of this resolution to the President of the United States, the President of the United States Senate, the Speaker of the United States House of Representatives, the Speaker of the House and the President of the Senate of each state’s legislature and each Member of Congress from the State of Arizona.

    =================================

    Missouri says

    Whereas, Barack Obama, President of the United States, has promised that one of the top priorities of his new Administration is to sign into law the “Freedom of Choice Act” which purports to classify abortion as a “fundamental right” equal in stature to the right of free speech and the right to vote – rights that, unlike abortion, are specifically enumerated in the United States Constitution; and

    Whereas, the federal Freedom of Choice Act would invalidate any “statute, ordinance, regulation, administrative order, decision, policy, practice, or other action” of any federal, state, or local government or governmental official, or any person acting under governmental authority, that would “deny or interfere with a woman’s right to choose” abortion, or that would “discriminate against the exercise of the right…in the regulation or provision of benefits, facilities, services, or information”; and

    Whereas, the federal Freedom of Choice Act would nullify any federal or state law “enacted, adopted, or implemented before, on, or after the date of [its] enactment” and would effectively prevent the State of Missouri from enacting similar protective measures in the future…
    =====================
    Washington says
    That this serve as a Notice and Demand to the federal government to maintain the balance of powers where the Constitution of the United States established it and to cease and desist, effective immediately, any and all mandates that are beyond the scope of its constitutionally delegated powers.

  122. Reference:

    New Hampshire’s House Concurrent Resolution 6
    Arizona’s HCR 2024
    Missouri House Resolution 212
    Washington House Joint Memorial 4009

  123. Nannymm

    Thanks for the info, Vince. I agree that at times the Fed Gov’t tries to infringe on states’ rights and the states must resist. But that has happened under many administrations; I don’t see where it has happened yet under the Obama admin.

  124. Nannymm

    BTW…welcome to the BackChannel, Vince. It’s good to have another voice and perspective. Our philosophy here is that it’s OK to disagree, but not to be disagreeable. I’m glad you noticed. Again, welcome and ,please,, stay awhile and add your voice to the mix.

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